澳洲Australia property In It's Simplest Form ... | Sydn

在澳大利亚 The pool at of an IP needs to be resurfaced (or so the pool doctor says), the cost was estimated to be $10K ($10,000), after recoverying from my impresssion of a cat coughing up a fur ball, it just seems far too much. Its just a standard poo I need some advice regarding a property purchase. Property - semi-detached house Bedrooms - 2 Condition - average needs internal reno to modernise Street - one of the best in suburb Location - excellent Close to schools - yes Transport - 50m

OK, so today Mike and I went to a couple of Display Homes and two ‘Open for Inspections’.

Being a lovely Melbourne day, we allowed ourselves plenty of time, and after seeing the totally gorgeous display homes had time for a McCafe and cake ($14) before the Opens.

On the way home, having parked near the first Open, walked to the second then back up along the beach to Ground Zero (where we watched our tenants playing basketball in the street to the sound of lots of boom boom music), so after a lovely afternoon out and about (approx 100 kms, = Tolls x $19, Petrol x $25), I suggested we call in to the local Thai for dinner.

Bottle of Margaret River sauv blanc, some curry puffs, a couple of shared curries and some lovely, fragrant jasmine rice ($65)

So what did our pleasant Melbourne afternoon cost? Somewhere about $125.

Centrelink provides an Age Pension of $335.40 per week for a Single person, or $252.85 each if a Couple.

Yes, I know there are other supplements, bonus etc. My point is:

If your only income was the Age Pension, how often could you afford to have ‘pleasant afternoons’ such as Mike and I enjoyed today?

Sure, we could have taken a thermos and a sandwich – and when we do build this new home, we intend to take the thermos to the end of the street, or across to the park, as a matter of course. Having these places of recreation so close by are certainly part of the appeal of the place.

The driving, tolls, petrol, coffee, cake and curry dinner are not the usual Saturday afternoon fare.

But for many older Australians, spending $125 when this was not a Special Occasion such as a Birthday, would be an unjustifiable – even distressing - extravagance.

Sometimes, people ask ‘why invest?’ or ‘why do you invest?’

Today is a good reason why we invest.

Mike and I intend to live a very long time. God willing, at least twenty to thirty years after we have left the paid workforce. That’s a very long time without curry puffs or the occasional bottle of sauv blanc.

While we in Australia have much to be grateful for – and the Age Pension is a particular blessing and not to be sneezed at – the Pension is provided to keep people off the street, not gallivanting about eating miniature cheese cakes at Maccas.

Many motivational speakers suggest putting up pictures around the house, clipped to the sun visor in the car, or stuck on your diary, of large houses, flash motor vehicles, yachts or other such trophies as goals to motivate us to work harder, earn more, save more, invest.

For me, none of the trophy goals have ever taken my fancy (although I am really looking forward to this new house by the beach, this has not been a ‘goal’ in the motivational sense).

Today’s experience and reflection lead me to this:

The greatest goal is that of freedom. To be financially free means being able to take that Saturday afternoon drive and to not worry or even think about the cost of the petrol. To be financially free means being able to enjoy an afternoon coffee, and to decide on the way home to detour via a restaurant with real tables and chairs and proper cutlery on the table.

To be financially free means that there is a purpose to all the work that Mike and I have done over what now adds up to 90 years of working life between us.

Every time I drive past the Mission Brown Wonder I remember the five years of mind boggling work I, and my staff, put in and which resulted in my purchase of that house. When we watched our tenants playing basketball today we were watching work in action – theirs, and ours.

So I know it sounds simplistic, but I ask you this:

At it’s most basic, in it’s simplest form, what does Financial Freedom’ mean to you?

When you really think about it, may be the answer simply is, Fourty-Two.

Lotsa love

Must spread.

To answer your question Kristine. Freedom. That's it. I don't care about fancy houses and expensive cars and 100K p.a. income. I just want my gosh darn freedom. Not living my life to the beat of another man's drum.  

I agree with you Kristine. Having the freedom.

The pensioners who live on nothing else except what the government provides, in my opinion, do not deserve anything else.

They had a whole lifetilme to prepare, and chose to live "in the moment".
I never feel sorry for them. The "in the moment" young people, most likely think investors are stupid for depriving themselves, during the early years.  

Yes; it is all about the freedom.

I would have written something like that Kathryn, but if did it, I'd be attacked. Now it's your turn. :D

In fairness; some people's financial situation could have gone out of their control, but I agree with you: mostly self inflicted. Many simply resign themselves to a spartan life (financially) early on and don't try from that point on.

My parents were poor, and retired as pensioners. They had lower incomes, but so do lots of investors. The difference was they had little investing and financial knowledge, and I never saw either of them try to get that education and improve their chances. They were quite intelligent too, so they would have done well I reckon.

My dad spent every saturday with his ear glued to the race calls on the radio, or tinkering in the shed. Nothing wrong with either activity, but they aint gunna help you get rich I suspect.

Whilst they enjoyed themselves with the little money they had; they couldn't go on any significant travel trips, or stay in a nice hotel, or go out for a really you beaut lunch, etc.

Every week was a (financial) struggle for them, and my mother died owing several years' of unpaid rates on her house (unbeknown to any of us kids); she was on a payment plan for them.


Most of the pensioners I come across (and I interact with loads of them through work and my previous life for 30 years as a golf pro) are financially uneducated. I think most of us could say the same about the ones we know.

Nothing wrong with being financially uneducated, but many have a "closed mind' attitude about money, numbers, forms, debt, banks, technology and all that. They then proceed to wear being a pensioner like a blood-soaked badge and whine about how hard life is...

I think the whole purpose is to get the freedom; to not have to be grinding away at the 9-5 job you hate until you drop, to be able to go to MovieWorld, or a trip to the Antarctic, or a nice car, to be able to just go out for dinner to a nice restaurant at the drop of a hat, to help various charities and those less fortunate, etc.

That's financial freedom for me.  

I concur...
but I also want something to leave to my children, and also to have enough to support them and do nice things for them when they are adults and have their own families.  

"McCafe and cake ($14)"

I couldn't see past McCafe and cake @ $14.
This included the whole family right ??? not just two.

Maybe I should get out more.  

9 years ago when work was a bit short I ended up working at a combination nursing home/units doing maintenance.
I assure you it was an eye opener to see how some of the pensioners in the units lived, if you call it living. I would hate to go back now.

I look at blokes spending 2k on a weekend and wonder what they and their partners will do in the future. Not as if the pension system isn't in danger of collapsing as well.  

nww said: ↑
"McCafe and cake ($14)"

I couldn't see past McCafe and cake @ $14.
This included the whole family right ??? not just two.

Maybe I should get out more.Click to expand...
If you come to canada...coffee and muffin is always $1.39 +tax
Today we splurged at Mc Donalds and had "Mc Doubles" (double cheeseburger) at $1.39 and a large rootbeer for $1.00  

Freedom to me

Freedom is being content and blissful with what you have now, not worrying about whats going to happen in the future or what has happened it he past.

Freedom is having the ability to not let anything to effect your inner self, living each moment to the greatest possible extent.

Freedom is about playing the game BUT not being a part of it.

Being able to chase after the ideal retirement kitty but not letting it get to you.

Finding true true freedom within yourself.......is the key

Once this happens I think everything else becomes so easy, decisions are taken easily, investments are chosen wisely, and it all falls in place as real priorities unfold themselves. The "fear" and "greed" factor are taken out of the equation.

And strangely most investors I have met have these traits without even knowing it :)


Nice post Kristine - as always - a pleasure to read.

Kristine.. said: ↑
what does Financial Freedom’ mean to you?Click to expand...

It's a tough one to answer. At the start of the journey, it was simply to ditch the job and get out from underneath the boss.

Once that has been done, you realise that you are still obligated to certain organisations - like the Bank, the clients, the residential Tenant's complaints...

We've found true freedom is very very difficult to attain, as there are very few truly passive investments which are robust enough to grow capitally, produce good income and some other bugger gets to do all the work.

I was speaking to a few people on Friday night who own very successful businesses employing many staff.....but they are still heavily active in the business and it is like an albatross around their neck.....it's always there and always tugging at their time constraints. Other elderly folk we chatted to had a more passive investment, with mainly cash deposits and a few shares...so their time was more their own, but they suffered with uncertain capital appreciation - if at all, and average income.

True freedom is certainly a worthwhile goal, but I'm nowhere near that position with our current structure. I suppose we could choose to be, but it would involve one almighty CGT cheque, whcih would wipe out many years of growth / profit. It was too damn hard accumulating it to simply hand it over in the stroke of a pen to the Govt. I guess true freedom can wait just a bit longer.  

These Age Pension payment rates are effective from 20 March 2011.

An income and assets[1] test will be used to work out how much you can get.

Status- Pension rate per fortnight

Single- $670.90*
Couple- $505.70* each

*These amounts exclude the Pension Supplement[2] amount which is currently a maximum of $58.40 a fortnight for singles and $88.00 a fortnight for couples (combined).Click to expand...
And a previous post by RH on Retiree's Living costs

Ridin-High said:
According to this article posted on the morningstar Australia Website


Mentions in the article that

"The benchmark findings indicated that a couple looking to achieve a comfortable retirement need to spend $53,456 a year, while those seeking a modest retirement lifestyle need to spend $30,382 a year."Click to expand...
I’m certainly looking for a sustainable retirement income beyond that offered by the aged-pension and increasing in post-retirement years to keep pace with inflation. With inflation running at around 3% a year, it’s important to remember that your buying power would be cut in half in about 25 years.

I’ve worked with a number of older people who retired and then got hit by the stock-market crashes so went back to part-time work and others who retired earlier or later and didn’t get savaged as badly, so I guess timing and type of investments is crucial. Listed Property Trusts (or REITS) falling up to 90% would be no fun.

Safe, Flexible, Capital Growth, Relieable Income Sources, Tax Efficiency and an ability to pass onto successors would seem to be part of the strategy required for myself, is there ever is such a beast though

I envisage my retirement as something like a partial retirement, maybe with a gap year to begin with ;)

“Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving”- Albert Einstein

-How about those old greek fella's you oft talk of with regards to Commercial Property Dazz, are they Re-tired or Never-Tired?

Its like an old guy down at the In-Laws retirement village, the fight with the village management over an ongoing issue (and the stockmarket) keeps him going I believe

I'll go out on a limb here and risk being attacked like road kill from a flock of vultures :eek: and say that I think the old age pension in this country is quite generous. IF, and that's a big 'IF' you OWN your own home. ie. you've worked hard, sacrificed, maybe invested all your life and, when your 65th Birthday arrives, you go on the aged pension - I don't think you have anything to complain about. Sure, no doubt it would be tough if you had to pay rent - and that's why I always say that people should invest in some sort of real estate as soon as they can possibly afford it - the younger you are the better.

I'm sure...no...I KNOW of families who, after paying a mortgage on modest homes in the regional NSW area where I live, don't have as much money left over to pay bills as some of the old age pensioners whinging about how they 'need more to survive' - bills that don't come with a pensioner rebate either.

*places target on back in readiness*  

Kristine - I've gotta share the love, but brilliant post. Very thought provoking.

I often try and remind myself of these same thing you point out (the ability to get in the car and drive without stressing about petrol, having a treat a McCafe, etc). We are quite 'tight' financially at the moment, but we still have the ability to enjoy taking the family out to dinner once a fortnight ($100 for a family of five) or enjoying some other simple enjoyments (yet accumulatively expense). It wasn't that long ago we really were struggling (living on youth allowance, and walking to uni when the bike ran out of petrol, eating durum wheat pasta 5 nights a week, so I could save up to buy a much needed textbook). I am very greatful for what I now have.

What is financial freedom to me??? Something I haven't quite attained yet, but am working towards. To me, it means not feeling the pressure of knowing you are cutting things close. It means having a buffer that is growing (not shrinking) and still being able to enjoy those days out - without first checking to make sure no bills are due.

We were at that point and then decided to invest. :D
But the investments are a way of ensuring that when we once again reach this point, we will also be comfortable and secure that we will be able to maintain it even though retirement. :)  

Freedom is your lovely Saturday afternoon, but on whichever days of the week I choose.  

Quote Janis Joplin, from the song 'Me and Bobby McGee' :
"Freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose"
Think about it, freedom does not exist.  

Graingrower said: ↑
Quote Janis Joplin, from the song 'Me and Bobby McGee' :
"Freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose"
Think about it, freedom does not exist.Click to expand...
Granted, "Absolute" freedom does not exist or so would "Absolute" Anarchy; we all have a rule book to play by. What's your definition of Freedom though?

I tend to think of Freedom in the context of "Financial Freedom" and the Power to Choose on some level and within reason what I do  

Kristine.. said: ↑
At it’s most basic, in it’s simplest form, what does Financial Freedom’ mean to you?

When you really think about it, may be the answer simply is, Fourty-Two.

Lotsa love
KristineClick to expand...
In one word "Time",the money factor is not important it helps,there is a lot in that post of yours Kristine but as someone said to me the other day
how many weekends is left in your life,all i said was it's does not matter today is only just starting,,


Sounds like a lovely day Kristine.
Display homes are great to visit to get ideas.

However l am a bit shocked that after a nice drive you cop a $19 toll bill.:eek:
I am very glad we do not have tolls in the West.
This unavoidable cost must really bite into the weekly budget of many many homes.
I quess for many there would also be parkings fees on top of tolls each day.

Yes, yes, and yes...(another great read to me), thankyou as always, I too am required to spread kudos around, but you have in spirit nontheless.

Financial independence has, (and is) my goal, freedom to me, goes along in that context...I love days out, looking at property, (or buying property:D) and especially coffee and cake. In fact I am coffee-ing (Captain's Conscience) right now along with an apple thing, a slice with I think they said sour cream? (it doesn't taste sour :confused:), 2.50 for slice, 3.20 for coffee. The coffee is divine, Ms K.  

willair said: ↑
In one word "Time",the money factor is not important it helps,there is a lot in that post of yours Kristine but as someone said to me the other day
how many weekends is left in your life,all i said was it's does not matter today is only just starting,,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDUdT5z_CBUClick to expand...
Actually willair if you work out how many weekends you have left [going by the average ] it is a bit scary.
However l try to do this... everyday l make it , make it the best day that l can.

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